OscailtDrink and A Country Town in Modern Ireland.<b>" How many of us can put our hands up and say we are not ourselves primarily responsible for the culture of drunkenness that our children are now embracing with such eagerness?"</b>
Breaking news: Italian MP, Sgarbi denounces the Statistical Fraud on COVID-19. The speech of the Member of Parliament Vittorio Sgarbi in the session of the Italian Camera, Meeting no. 331 of Friday 24, April, 2020. Vittorio Sgarbi, denounces the closure of 60% of the businesses for 25,000 COVID-19 Deaths, of which the National Institute of Health says 96.3% died NOT of COVID-19 but of other pathologies. That means only 925 have died of the virus. 24,075 have died of other things.2006-09-14T15:54:07+00:00Indymedia Irelandimc-ireland@lists.indymedia.iehttp://www.indymedia.ie/atomfullposts?story_id=78384http://www.indymedia.ie/graphics/feedlogo.gifExcellent report Miriam - your frustration and wishes for change come across very stronglyhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1670992006-09-14T15:54:07+00:00Allen MeagherThe problem is country-wide. It suits the powers-that-be to try to shut down con...The problem is country-wide. It suits the powers-that-be to try to shut down concerned and active people from the community like you. So keep it up!<br />
A query? Do you need to be over a certain age to hire a bus? Under the law, someone has to be responsible for leading any group of young people on a bus-tour. If someone dies on the bus home - who was responsible for their welfare at that time? Check it out - might lead to some the bus services being shut down, maybe.<br />
By the way, 'Changing Ireland' magazine focuses on the work of 190 community-run, government-funded Community Development Projects around the country. There is a CDP in Clonakilty - it is run by and for the Traveller community especially - and the development workers and volunteer workers there would be worth talking to.<br />
Allen Meagher,<br />
Sarsfield Gardens,<br />
Moyross,<br />
Limerickvery timely report miriamhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1671732006-09-15T01:21:54+00:00wageslaveIn light of the junior cert results and the ensuing orgy of drinking some of whi...In light of the junior cert results and the ensuing orgy of drinking some of which I personally witnessed. Not enough blame is attributed to the profiteering drinks companies for the cancer they promote in our society. Alcopops was such a cynical exercise, targetting the young and vulnerable. And where are the drinks companies when the social problems manifest themselves in underage pregnancy and A&E resource consumption. There seems to be little will among greedy politicians (huge tax revenue from drink) to address this epidemic. This Has To Stophttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1671852006-09-15T08:38:10+00:00Concernedwhat lunatic fire are we playing with when teenage girls are able to go out in s...<em>what lunatic fire are we playing with when teenage girls are able to go out in short skirts, without underwear, for sexual encounters with boys, often complete strangers, who in turn expect to be gratified with oral and other sex ? in gardens, in public toilets, in any space they can find for the purpose ? all fuelled by alcohol and drugs.</em><br />
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Perhaps the town could fund the gardai to carry out underwear inspections of young<br />
people (although of course it is up to parents to take the lead in this). It would<br />
require a hike in the local rates but it would be worth it in order to stop the<br />
depravity. <br />
<br />
A great deal of this behaviour is also the result of what our children are taught,<br />
or rather not taught in our schools.<br />
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I think that it is very important that young people are not led into dangerous habits by the neglect of their parents and their own neglect of Our Lord and Savior and for girls especially the consequences can be dire <br />
<a href="http://www.suite101.com/lesson.cfm/18429/1675/3" title="http://www.suite101.com/lesson.cfm/18429/1675/3">http://www.suite101.com/lesson.cfm/18429/1675/3</a><br />
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I think something that might be effective in this campaign would be if a picture could be obtained of the man defecating on the doorstep or the young wanton urinating. Was the porch light on when he opened the door and could he see everything? I would be very interested in seeing them. They could be posted here so that the council can see how bad the problem is. Possibly the town could obtain closed circuit televisions for the purpose of recording these events and watching them later. In the UK, which I am very familiar with, the government has obtained remarkable success in reducing this type of behaviour and where it has been determined that these children are in fact miniature criminals <br />
<a href="http://www.crimereduction.gov.uk/youth/youth73.htm" title="http://www.crimereduction.gov.uk/youth/youth73.htm">http://www.crimereduction.gov.uk/youth/youth73.htm</a><br />
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In the meantime the only thing that can be done if the gardai are not going to<br />
intervene is for concerned citizens and parents to carry out these underwear<br />
spot-checks themselves. It may seem difficult in the short term but it will have results in the end which I think the young women will thank us for. Perhaps the retired British police officer and the Sinn Fein councillors could collaborate together on this project? In the light of the historical difficulties they may have had in getting on together this might also have the advantage of being a healing activity for them, leading to greater cross-border co-operation and trade.<br />
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In addition to the suggested activities of chess and (brisk) walks time would be well spent for the youth of today if they were to listen to some of the more charismatic and uplifting words of the genuinely spiritual. Audio cassettes can be obtained from The Legion of Mary and I can think of nothing better than listening to these instead of going to a dirty,<br />
smoke-filled pub to spend money and behave like an animal.<br />
<br />
<em>The meeting was told that gardens and public places are all routinely used as<br />
toilets and for sexual activity.</em><br />
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And as you rightly point out some of the sex acts these misguided young women are<br />
engaged in are not just oral or genital and so the link with toilets becomes<br />
stronger. This has got to stop. I think that again, pictures of this activity should be posted here and again in the UK, they have found that "name and shame" campaigns have a great effectiveness against anti-social behaviour so it might work here too<br />
<a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4306333.stm" title="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4306333.stm">http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4306333.stm</a><br />
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Finally, I think that the role of soft, tooth-rotting drinks, crisps and chocolates have been overlooked in all this. It is well known that these provide so much surplus energy (for fornicating and "teabagging") that young people are now actually more obese on average than ever."Losing its Soul"..brief observations for what they are worth!http://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1671872006-09-15T09:52:16+00:00CiaronI was raised in the Irish diaspora. The diaspora is often a vacuum sealed experi...I was raised in the Irish diaspora. The diaspora is often a vacuum sealed experience of the culture from whence it came (remember superman getting sent off by marlon brando in the original movie?), less affected by the global trends, modernisation, new consumer led colonisation in the place of origin etc. <br />
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The diaspora is also under siege and that crystalises cultural identity. You're not going to be treated as thick, primitive, irrational, dangerous for merely being Irish in the 26 counties. You were in Australia, London, U.S. in the '50's, '60's and '70's. In the 6 counties some people paid with their lives merely for Irish cultural identity. In Australia you got into fights defending it....or you internalised it and led half a life, drop the "O" from your surname and anglicised.<br />
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I hitched through the 26 counties in '79 primarily to meet my granparents. I started visiing here from Liverpool & London in '96 and moved here in '02 and have been kind of stuck here on bail since the beginning 0f '03 www.peaceontrial.com (Hasn't been so bad, the most geographical staibiity in 20 years was probably timely!)<br />
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My general observations is that you have a culture in reaction, an enormous pendulum swing from the realities of '79. People have generally thrown the spiritual baby out with the religiuos bathwater and embraced consumerism for identity (out with the St. Christopher's medals in with the Nike swoosh!). <br />
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You have a rapid breakdown of communty and extended family and atomisation. Responses include the "virtual community" of getting shitfaced on alcohol 2-4 nights a week. Disposable spending, brand enslavement and increased credit card debt. More freedom at the point of consumption, heightened conformity, less anti-authroitarianism in the culture. An apathy or intense negativity to anyone who feels passionate about anything- beside getting shitfaced on alcohol and defining that as freedom from the daily reality you hate. A confusion between being cynical and being sophisticated. So those who speak out aginast injustice and for peace are generally viewed as unsophisticated and primitive ( a bit like the Irish were viewed in Australia when I was growing up, so you've made me fell right at home!). <br />
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The general attirude becomes hostile to the activist (like the homeless) and we have retreated into the virtual activsim of the internet Not really concernedhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1671892006-09-15T10:05:43+00:00M CottonHow droll. It doesnt seem likely that you have a child who could be affected by ...How droll. It doesnt seem likely that you have a child who could be affected by these circumstances because if you did you wouldnt think the situation remotely funny. This has nothing to do with moral crusading of the sort you would like to pretend it is (that is your agenda and irrelevant to the issues here, in fact). I dont suppose many people reading this article who have children could sit down in front of their 5-year old daughter, for example, and happily contemplate the idea of her at 16 performing oral sex on a stranger while mindlessly drunk, in some other strangers back yard at 3.0' clock in the morning. If of course that scenario is as amusing to you as it appears to be, then God help your children. In fact, you dont deserve them.<br />
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In writing the article the unlikely and extraordinary juxtaposition of the different people who attended that meeting was not lost on me nor anyone there. To find an ex British police officer and a Sinn Fein councillor sharing concern (the genuine variety) over a social issue was striking. To further find them sharing a view that there is a serious problem at senior management levels within the Garda was pretty extraordinary. But nobody there disagreed with them about that or about anything else they had to say. The police officer was a nice man who clearly understood issues such as alienation that young people migt feel and the need to involve everyone - for everyone to own both the problem and the solution. He had dedicated his working life to just that approach and clearly was decent and courageous enough to come to a public meeting in Ireland and say what he thought. It was not an easy thing for him to do.<br />
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There is much to be unahppy with about what some Gardai have been doing and where corruption has occurred no doubt that it should be pursued and stamped out. The cover ups and so forth are appalling for their victims and ultimately self-destructive for the Gardai. But it is not fair to tar every single one of them with that brush, and particularly in the lower ranks where people are responsible for picking up the pieces of society's social ills, there is a lot of genuine goodwill that goes unacknowledged.<br />
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There is a serious crisis with young adults. It may not affect all of them to the same extent and in writing the article I was very conscious that the situation described is of a whole order of play to the situation in inner cities where their environment alone can dictate very sad outcomes, irrespective of the effort young people may try to put into making life work for themselves. As I said, Clonakilty has good amenities and facilities. A lot of country towns are like that and yet there is this pathetic 'there is nothing for them to do' attitude which is simply not true. I dont mean to imply either that people in inner cities dont take charge of their environment and that there are not some great initiatives and opportunities created for young people that might not exist in a country town, but there are undeniable, additional disadvantages in some places - especially large sprawling estates where no consideration has been given to the importance of the aesthetic or social impacts of rotten architecture and planning - to take just two examples.<br />
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ermhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1672102006-09-15T13:35:33+00:00bansheehappily contemplate the idea of her at 16 performing oral sex on a stranger whil...<em>happily contemplate the idea of her at 16 performing oral sex on a stranger while mindlessly drunk</em><br />
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What's wrong with that? It's pretty harmless after all. Kids experiment sexually in their teenage years. I did and I learned a lot. While I agree that getting mindlessly drunk is a problem, sexual experimentation in teenage years is crucial to the development of a happy and healthy sexuality later. So the actual facts arehttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1672212006-09-15T14:58:30+00:00Give me a breakThat the majority of the town councillors say that there's no problem and that t...That the majority of the town councillors say that there's no problem and that the Gardai say there's no problem but that some SFers ( a party well known in the North for there stirling community work against "anti social elements") have a bee in their bonnet about kids getting drunk and fucking each other.<br />
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Fair play to the councillors of Clonakilty for having their heads screwed on. If there's a problem with people crapping on the doorsteps then install some public toilets.<br />
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Kids have been getting drunk and getting busy for millennia.other side of the coinhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1672252006-09-15T15:19:28+00:00c murray I have children , one of whom is getting to the age of 16.
and I am concerned m... I have children , one of whom is getting to the age of 16.<br />
and I am concerned more about the interference in his personal choice<br />
by the offices of the state, under the new statutory rape laws, consent issue.<br />
<br />
when they are born they are individual people, you as a parent are a guide<br />
seeking to impose a morality led by a male dominated church/state alliance <br />
which is gender-imbalanced is not the way to achieve freedom of choice<br />
and expression for what is essentially a young man or woman and not a child.<br />
<br />
the nanny state must be urged to loosen its apron strings.Why "Underage" drinkinghttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1672712006-09-15T22:08:08+00:00MikeWhy do we persist with this sacred cow of the 18 age limit for legal drinking. S...Why do we persist with this sacred cow of the 18 age limit for legal drinking. Surely a graduated age system (different ages for beer and vodka) like they have in Germany would make more sense ? <br />
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So-called Underage drinking is not the problem but EXCESSIVE drinking is one of the biggest social problems facing Irish (and UK) society and it trancends all age groups. Teenagers are simply aping the behaviour and attitudes of their elders. A ban on alcohol advertising (and sports sponsorship) would be a big help but vested interests will ensure that this isint going to happen today or tomorrow. ... jeeezus h. chrr-ist, Miriam !!http://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1674622006-09-18T01:56:31+00:00Herma FroditeI confess I could not (be bothered to actually) read your oppressively long arti...I confess I could not (be bothered to actually) read your oppressively long article, as I value my eyesight and brain too much to waste them on such shite, but just by SCANNING over it, I have the distinct impression that you hang around with the pigs far more than is possibly healthy.<br />
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Also, obsessing about other people's sex-lives is really no substitute for having one of your own - as in the old saying, "people either talk about sex all the time, or have it"<br />
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Am I wrong in thinking control-freakery is a major dimension in your life?<br />
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Anyhoo, my Top Tips to your happiness would be:<br />
1. get laid every now and again<br />
2. shun all kinds of swines, even if they have HUGE truncheons<br />
3. try yoga<br />
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However, I could be wrong, maybe you will go on to become the inventoress of the Garda-Approved Self-Imploding Chastity-Belt - hey, that should be a big seller in George Bush's America.<br />
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Oh, and to answer your question - "How many of us can put our hands up and say we are not ourselves primarily responsible for the culture of drunkenness that our children are now embracing with such eagerness?" - - well, everybody (including myself) who has not contributed to humanity's collective problem by producing offspring can safely absolve themselves from that particular guilt-trip. <br />
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Have a nice day, Sweetie.Public Disorder in Clonhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1682272006-09-22T10:58:17+00:00DODBeing a native of Clonakilty, I have to say this issue is of major concern. Just...Being a native of Clonakilty, I have to say this issue is of major concern. Just incase people want to underestimate what is going on, the weekend prior to the announcement of a first public meeting saw a number of serious incidents. One young man was hit with an iron bar, there was at least one stabbing reported and rumours of more, another young person was badly beaten, some noses were broken, etc. <br />
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At the first public meeting a doctor commented on the scenes she saw of what she described as a 'riot' in the town. After the incident, another commented on the sight of seven youngsters waiting in South Doc to be treated for serious injuries. It was pretty severe.<br />
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Being a party colleague of cllrs Hayes and O' Súilleabháin and a friend of independent Cllr. Anthony MacDermot, I know they would not do anything to purposefullydamage the name of Clonakilty; a town they all love very much (and rightly so), but something had to be done. The Garda Supt commented that Clonakilty was no different in this regard to any Cork County town, he may well be right, but that doesn't excuse the fact that it is happening anywhere. A major problem here is the drink culture in this country. Unless you do something about that, situations like these will continue.First stepshttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1718442006-10-16T17:44:22+00:00J. M. D. McKevitry, PPWhile I am gratified at the concern raised and expressed over the issue of drugg...While I am gratified at the concern raised and expressed over the issue of drugged and intoxicated young women wandering the environs of Clonakilty without underwear, it is with great regret that I notice no positive steps have been taken in this matter.<br />
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I am also concerned that those whose moral well being is most threatened by this deplorable trend are nowhere mentioned in the discussion: to wit the young men who will be tempted to surrender their chastity and their souls.<br />
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To this end I am proposing that concerned volunteers should meet at Hart's Coffee Shop on Saturday week. I shall be travelling from Dublin with two lay brothers who also have a keen interest in, and experience with young women's underwear. I should point out that their wiles are by no means confined to leaving the safety of their homes and their loving parents with the breeze, and the devil, between their legs, but that some of them adhere, as it were, to the letter of the law. By this I mean that I have been observing that many young women are now clad in what is called a "thung". These thungs are nothing but the flimsiest bits of string and it is very possible to see almost entirely down their derriers when they bend over. I have taken many photos of this and will be bringing them with me to educate others.<br />
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I look forward to meeting the author and the local councillors. As I am on temporary leave I shall be able to assist in patrolling with other volunteers should some kind soul be able to provide me with a lodging in the area.maybe not such a great thinghttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/78384#comment1719282006-10-17T10:04:12+00:00c. morris"erm
by banshee Fri Sep 15, 2006 12:35
happily contemplate the idea of her at 1..."erm<br />
by banshee Fri Sep 15, 2006 12:35<br />
happily contemplate the idea of her at 16 performing oral sex on a stranger while mindlessly drunk<br />
<br />
What's wrong with that? It's pretty harmless after all. Kids experiment sexually in their teenage years. I did and I learned a lot. While I agree that getting mindlessly drunk is a problem, sexual experimentation in teenage years is crucial to the development of a happy and healthy sexuality later."<br />
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Its good to see Jonathan King has embraced the internet and is taking a keen interest in the kids of West Cork. Honestly though, its always hard to raise these problems without someone saying relax, thats just the way kids are nowadays. From talking with kids, parents and teachers I'd say this stuff now starts at 13 in some areas. But hey, what your problem man?<br />