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Another death caused by Garda Hospitality? - The parents of John Moloney demand an independent inquiry dublin |
crime and justice |
feature
 Monday April 10, 2006 14:47 by kevin - imc éire
Parents Of John Moloney Attend Dail Protest
An interview with John and Sandra Moloney, the parents of "Johner" Moloney, who have joined up with the Wheelock family in their campaign in recent months. On March 23rd, the family of Terence Wheelock were joined outside the Dáil by the family of John (Johner) Moloney. They linked up with the Wheelock family, as they felt that both of their sons' deaths raised serious questions about their time in Garda Custody. Johner Moloney was found unconscious, bloodied and bruised, behind a church in Rathfarnam in May 2003, shortly after having been arrested for a couple of outstanding warrants for driving with no tax and insurance. He was brought to Tallaght Hospital with massive brain injuries, and never regained consciousness. He died when his life support machine was switched off."We got in contact with the Wheelock family for the protest outside the Dáil," says John Moloney, Johner's father. "We met them at a meeting in the Mansion House, that had people speaking who had been victims of Garda harassment up in Donegal. We introduced ourselves to each other, and starting talking and organising after that. Its been working out great with them. Once you have two families organising together, it seems to work better. You do get fed up sometimes with going into town, and its great to have the support." "I had been following Terence's case in the papers when it happened, and I had called up the Mater Hospital looking for contact details for the Wheelocks, but I was told they couldn't give out that information for confidentiality reasons," says Sandra, Johner's mother. "I kept an eye on the case still because there were very similar circumstances to what happened my son. We make a good team. Terence's mother Esther, she's been through the same pain as me, had the same experiences. When Tallaght Hospital called me to say my son was dying, it was like someone had ripped out my heart. Losing a son is just too hard to describe sometimes. " Sandra says that the family has recieved letters from some TDs in the Dáil, saying that they would bring it to the attention of the Minister for Justice, to see if an independent inquiry could be established. "That's all we want really, we just want the truth to come out. In my heart as a mother, I feel I know the truth already. But I want answers, recognition of what happened to him. My son was found on a street, at the back of a church, unconscious, approximately 15 minutes after he supposedly left the Garda station. "He walks into a Garda station perfectly healthy. He leaves not soon afterwards, supposedly with a spring in his step, as the Gardai say. Ten minutes later he's found 90% brain dead, with bruising to the chest, hips, and legs, and the back of the neck. I just really need answers to this. I didnt even know initially that my son had been brought to Tallaght Hospital. I heard a snippet of a report on the radio and something in me just recognised it was my son. I got a phone call from one of his friends on the bank holiday Monday [May 5th '03], telling me that Johner had been in Rathfarnam Garda Station. So I rang up Rathfarnam Garda station and they said that they never had anyone in there by the name of John Moloney. I rang Terenure Garda station, they said the same thing. Crumlin, Dundrum, the same answer." "His friend Alan Kennedy had been let out of the station the previous Sunday morning," says John. "When he was leaving he turned around to the Garda Sergeant and asked what the story was with his friend, Johner Moloney. The Garda replied to him that Johner had two outstanding warrants [for driving with no tax and insurance], and that he was going nowhere, except to court on Tuesday morning after the bank holiday. "On Tuesday, after we had heard the report early in the morning on the radio, I went up to the Crumlin Garda station at about 8 o'clock. I said that I was inquiring about a John Moloney, who was supposed to have been locked up here at the weekend, nobody seems to know where he is. The Garda asked me what station had him, and I replied as far as I knew it had been Rathfarnam. The Garda then told me to walk down there myself, but I pleaded with him could he not just ring or radio down to them straight away, it would be much quicker and easier. A detective came into the office then, and heard me talking. He said that he had heard something on the radio too, so he rang Rathfarnam station for me. They said they never had any John Moloney in there. "The detective took my mobile number, and told me he would give me a call if he heard anything more. But just before I left, he asked me where Johner had his tattoo. I told him it was on his upper arm. I also told him that he was wearing a gold bracelet and a ring on his finger. The detective said to leave it with him, and he would get back to me. About fifteen minutes later my phone rang. It was the detective, telling me that my son was up in Tallaght Hospital with two Garda officers there. They would meet me at the hospital. So I went out there, and two detectives were waiting. I told the people at the desk that we were here to see John Moloney. "The detective on the phone had told me that my son just had a small bump on his head, that it would only be a headache. We went up to ICU (Intensive Care Unit), and a nurse brought us in. Then I saw my son. There were tubes everywhere. In his nose, down his throat, I'm not joking when I say everywhere. I went crazy. I started shouting and screaming at the two Garda right in the middle of the ward. They said it had nothing to do with them, that he hadnt been in custody at all over the weekend. I said to the doctor that I wanted every part of his body checked. The two Garda just handed me a card, and then they were gone out the door. "Where Johner was found at the back of the church, there was a man selling papers outside there, and a traveller begging for money as well, for hours. There would also have been hundreds of people going to and from mass. Yet nobody ever saw him." Sandra also did her own door to door inquiry up in the estate where Johner was found. "Oliver Hanley [a Garda Superintendent from Dun Laoghaire who investigates deaths in Garda custody in the Dublin region] had come to our house," she said. "We had been asking him questions about why the area had not been sealed off for forensic examination. He told us that it hadn't been necessary - but we argued that this standard practice until the cause of the injuries is established. He also told us that he had done his own inquiries in that estate, but when I asked the people in those houses he had supposedly talked to if a Garda had made house call inquiries, all of them said no. No Garda had ever come near their door. Later on we were handing out leaflets pleading to people for information. The Gardaí were following us around, watching us, intimidating us. "None of our witnesses were allowed to contribute to the inquiry afterwards. Oliver Hanley was investigating it, he was also in charge of the Terence Wheelock inquiry. Why are there so many cases similar to Johner's, with young men left heavily bruised or in a coma? There's another well known case down the country of Brian Rossiter. Another girl has contacted us personally about a young lad who was found dead in Tallaght with similar circumstances. Its nearly always the same situation, especially with brain injuries which can come from heavy pressure being put on someone's chest, but the Garda will always have an excuse or explanation to hand straight away. "The Coroner's Court inquest into my son's death finished with an open verdict, that fresh evidence was needed to further the investigation. How I am supposed to get fresh evidence? You have the Gardai investigating themselves. You're banging up against a brick wall. That's why we need people to help us with our campaign, so we can break down this brick wall. That's what I need." "A story appeared in The Star after his death claiming that Johner died of a huge overdose, which was very sickening to us," says John. "The paper had given us great coverage at the start. Then they rang me up to tell me they were going with this story of an overdose. This was even before the inquest. I said to the journalist that they had more information than me, that I had heard nothing about this at all. We reckon it was the Garda that passed on the information to The Star. The Star went ahead and printed the story about Johner taking a massive overdose of cocaine. Then when the inquest came around, it was concluded there was a minute trace being found in his urine four days after he had been initially admitted. "This came out on the Saturday after he died. The story claimed he had swallowed a very big bag of cocaine. Yet they found nothing in Tallaght hospital when he was brought in first. Marie Cassidy said in the inquest that she had never heard of someone Johner's age dying of a cocaine overdose from the amount of cocaine which was found in his urine, which was less than a pinhead's worth. But yet the doctors in Tallaght found no drugs in his system from the blood tests when he was admitted initially. Four days after he was admitted, they tested his urine because the Garda were involved, and they found a minute trace in his urine. So The Star ran with this story. "We subsequently made an appointment to see a Professor Keogh, who was on duty in the hospital when my son was brought in. We went up there and we were sitting outside his office waiting for him. I saw him walk over to his secretary, and she told him that the Moloney family were here to ask some questions. He gestured with his to his secretary to indicate to her that he wasnt in, and he didnt want to talk to us. He turned around and saw me looking at him, and said to me I had better come in. "We sat down and I said that there was rumours going around about cocaine in his body. I wanted to know if there was any alcohol in his system. He sat down and went through the list of records. I was asking him various questions, but I wanted to know what had killed Johner. Professor Keogh turned the records around to me, and at the end where the blood test results should have been, the end had been ripped off. He wasnt even able to tell me what blood group my son was. "The total length of time that Johner is supposed to have been in Rathfarnam Garda station is about 35 minutes. During this time there was a drug search, a check of his warrants, he went for a nap, and was also banging on the door of his cell - all within 35 minutes? When Johner was brought in, the cameras in the station supposedly weren't working either. I'm not saying that every Garda is a 'pig', but there are some real rotten apples out there. There needs to be totally independent investigations into complaints, assaults, and deaths of people while in Garda custody." Sandra feels that Johner's case would recieve more attention, and justice would be easier to obtain "if we had money or we were some big powerful family. The Club Anabel case is an example of this. Those families are wealthy, yet the young lads in the fight only got very light sentences for an assault that killed someone. Yet I guarantee you that if I had been my son, or someone else from around here [Crumlin], they would have gotten life for it. It's all about money and power in this country. "We need people out there to back us up, our family and the Wheelocks too. People believe that there's no way that the Garda would cause someone's death, but they said the same things years ago about Artane Industrial School, that such things would never happen. Similarly with the Morris tribunal at the moment, those two girls in Donegal who were mistreated in custody were just like us, up against that brick wall, but eventually the Garda came clean and made a statement - nearly ten years later. Things like this give me hope. Eventually the truth comes out, it may take years but we'll keep on fighting until we knock down that brick wall. "Its caused our whole family so much pain and stress, but I'll keep fighting no matter how many years it takes. Until we get justice we feel as if we arent really living, we're only just existing. We'll never give up hope. One day we'll get justice. It'll only be then that we can bury him, knowing what happened to him."
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Comments (37 of 37)
Jump To Comment: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37Good work Kevin and I wish the family the best in getting an inquiry . As I see it it has been pretty much confirmed by Sarg White at the tribunal that those practises that left Roisin McConnell in a psychiatric ward were quite common place for serious garda interrogations. And as this case obviously highlights it is not just your psychological health that could be in danger in some garda staions. In the Sunday Independent (I think last week) it was revealed that one of the leading criminal barristers in the Four Courts used to play a game with his clients where they would say what happened to them in custody and he would guess the garda conducting the toture. He could identify them from the different techniques they used. So this kind of thing is clearly routine in Ireland and a good percentage of deaths in custody is the inevitable consequence. And of course White also says that no record of any such treatment by the gardai ever appears in garda files which also means that they would deny any of this goes on when it would come up in court. He also admitted that the garda station was bugged to listen in to Solicitor-client conversations which is no doubt also routine in garda stations where their superiors have a particular interest in someone.
good luck anyway I think its clear that some momentum is building over these cases....
There are some incredibly worrying developments/proposals within the Garda Siochana at the moment. The Morris tribunal uncovering widespread corruption and abuse is long overdue, as is mentioned in the piece above it took nine years for one of the Gardai to come clean. It makes you wonder about 'bad apples' in other parts of the country, are they being detected, or are blatant breaches of the law and questionable explanations of treatment of people in custody being glossed over?
The Association of Garda Sergeants and Inspectors is meeting down in Killarney today for their annual conference. One of the motions down for discussion is to call on the Minister for Justice to authorise more members of the force in the use of firearms. This is in response to the rising gun crime in Dublin. First of all this is a knee-jerk response; after the Veronica Guerin murder in 1996, the Gardai were able to smash the drug dealing gangs and put many of the big players behind bars, without having to arm a larger section of the force. Secondly, when armed Gardai are present in a tense situation, it has been shown that they have not acted responsibly. The Barr Tribunal is slowly uncovering the unneccessary use of lethal force in stopping the siege by John Carthy at Abbeylara, while up in Lusk the ERU failed to inform the people working in the Post Office that an armed raid was coming up - this was despite weeks of planning to foil the raid! Why did the Gardai not arrest the men beforehand and simply stop the robbery in advance? It would seem the Garda would have preferred to see the robbery go ahead, and a wild-west style shootout to happen, in order to secure heavier convictions - yet running the risk of a bloodbath. One of the 'armed' raiders was also shot dead while running towards Gardai - armed with a hammer. The thought of the 'Guardians of the Peace' being armed in a situation in the city centre, such as the recent Dublin riots, does not put me at ease. Would armed Gardai fire shots from a distance at people overturning a car? I would think yes. Doubtlessly you would see all sorts of excuses and hyperbole in the aftermath, over-playing the level of danger in order to justify an extreme reaction.
Before ANY of the proposed changes of the Garda (including the part-time reserve force) come to light, there needs to be a Garda Ombudsman with a similar level of powers as Nuala O'Loan in the north. Any independent ombudsman needs to have powers to enter and search any Garda station WITHOUT a 24 hour prior warning to the station, to gather evidence where the ombudsman feels with due cause there has been a crime committed by members of An Garda Siochana. The age old question of 'who polices the police?' is not being addressed in this State. Every death in Garda custody should not be investigated by Oliver Hanley, or any other Garda. It does not matter what the background, circumstances, or class of the dead person is; it is plain common sense to understand that the Gardaí are not going to out their own colleagues in any internal inquiry.
The title is misleading.
JOhnner did NOT die in custody. He died after he was released.
Wheelock - non-story, truth will out and certain people will look very stupid. All questions can be answered satisfactorily but in the proper forum not via the media.
There was no cover-up, explanations are very simple.
Know nuttin about other case.
The Barr Tribunal is slowly uncovering the unneccessary use of lethal force in stopping the siege by John Carthy at Abbeylara
Do keep up, x. The tribunal is over and the report is expected imminently. And apart from a few red herrings over the provision of cigarettes none of the evidence showed that the ERU were anything less than patient in the extreme
.....while up in Lusk the ERU failed to inform the people working in the Post Office that an armed raid was coming up
Surely you jest on this one, what would happen if was an inside job?, would u go to work knowing an armed raid was about to take place, i dont think so.
besides it was unclear the exact premises targetted.
Why did the Gardai not arrest the men beforehand and simply stop the robbery in advance?
not that simple compadre
One of the 'armed' raiders was also shot dead while running towards Gardai - armed with a hammer
Not true. Can't say more.
. The thought of the 'Guardians of the Peace' being armed in a situation in the city centre, such as the recent Dublin riots, does not put me at ease. Would armed Gardai fire shots from a distance at people overturning a car?
This is patent rubbish. There were significant armed resources available at scene, all of whom elected not to draw firearms. Shots fired at a rioting crowd is dangerous and tends to lead to the firearm being 'borrowed' by the crowd.
Before ANY of the proposed changes of the Garda (including the part-time reserve force) come to light, there needs to be a Garda Ombudsman with a similar level of powers as Nuala O'Loan in the north. Any independent ombudsman needs to have powers to enter and search any Garda station WITHOUT a 24 hour prior warning to the station
Rubbish. there is no such proviso. You're getting confused with an investigation into general issues like administrataion etc.. Ombudsman can enter stations with no warning with some exceptions on security grounds. Anything else would be patently ridiculous.
.
Rubbish. there is no such proviso. You're getting confused with an investigation into general issues like administrataion etc.. Ombudsman can enter stations with no warning with some exceptions on security grounds. Anything else would be patently ridiculous.
The above is very unclear. Are you saying that Nuala O'Loan can enter without 24-hour notice? Or that a proposed future ombudsman should be able to enter without 24-hour notice in the Republic? Or that there is currently a police Ombudsperson in the Republic with the power to enter any Garda station immediately?
Also, your "not true, but can't prove it" is less than convincing. I can't tell you why, it's a secret. Sorry.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/breaking/story.asp?j=95008...87&x=
he is now seeking to discredit the genuine concerns of our members by trying to tarnish the reputation of the staff associations,” said general secretary PJ Stone.
The three-member Ombudsman Commission is being headed up by High Court judge Kevin Haugh and will begin investigating public complaints about gardaí next year. It will have between 50 and 100 staff, but will have to rely on gardaí to carry out many of its investigations.
“Our contention has always been the commission would be better served by having an independent investigative body similar to what exists in Northern Ireland rather than depending on gardaí to carry out the investigation of complaints and face accusations of bias,” said Mr Stone.
fair comment on ombudsman's powers, but nit-picking nonetheless
open to rebuttal on this one, but methinks that the Garda Siochana Act 2005 (Comencement) Order , S.I No. 129 of 2006 (commencment date 31st March 2006) gives effect to Part 5, i.e the Ombudsman bits. Therefore I am correct in my original posting and phuq hedd is correct in his/her third interpretation i.e that there is currently a Garda Ombudsman with power to enter Garda stations without any notice. Notwithstanding this, this is theoretical as there are no investigators/staff/I.T/logistics for the Commission yet.
As for the accusations of secrecy, I plead guilty to teasing but there are various legal issues involved here and when the evidence comes out it will be more than convincing that nothing untoward happened to Wheelock. Oh dear sounding a bit like MMD here, i know what i know coz i know so there.....
How about you ring the Wheelers NOW put them out of the misery you needn't tell us.
Still no independent ombudsmen so it is of very limited use.
I can't tell you what it is, but when it comes out it will prove that disleacht is a lying agent of the state who is being paid to smear the Wheelocks and to muddy the waters about this death. The other evidence that I have (sorry can't say) will reveal some fairly interesting details about disleacht's mum and her relationship to 'farmyard' pornography.
I understand that this is a patently pathetic way of attempting to sow misinformation but it's always worth throwing a big of mud, if you throw enough some might stick and, after all, I know what I know.
I remember a shocking picture on the evening heald last year which showed a young man laid out in his family's home in a coffin. Again, the madia and his family had jumped to conclusions about this mans death an were firmly pointing the finger at Gardaí abusing this prisoner in their custody. The Gardaí immediatly stated that during this mans custody he came to no harm and no one believed them, until the toxicology report came back and stated that the man had a large amount of cocaine pushed up his rectum. The Gardai were doing their job arresting this man for a search, he was breaking the law having a controlled substance on his person, he panicked put it up his rectum, the package leaked and poisoned his body! Gardaí are an easy target to point the finger at but in this case a criminal killed himself breaking the law! Tough! I don't remember the Hearld writing an explanation to his death after!
Because when the evidence of what was pulled from mossie's ass emerges, you're all in for quite a surprise.
Sorry, can't say now, legal stuff y'know. But I know what I know and when that juicy evidence comes out....
I have read a lot of rubbish and allegations against the wheelock and maloney family . and this agent of the state spreading smear on this site has been detected.
the claim of jonner maloney haveing coke up his rectum.
is sad and disrespectful it is complete rubbish jonner died from brain injuries he HAD severe swelling to his brain consistent with blunt trauma to the head. this agent is complaing about the media but also quotes there lies fed by gardia. The facts are there. he also did not sign a release form compulsory for any one leaving agarda station. they told his friend he had warrants for motoring offence and fine. also this agent state he is privy to inside info about the whelock case but cant talk @legal stuff ye know.
But i also have "inside info" and when it does emerge about wheelock case it will be truly shocking the family cant reveal certian details about terence's death but they are extremely serious. also as an agent put it this is not the arena for these facts to emerge i agree it deserves to scrutinise the facts the only way to do this is a full independent public inquiry for both the wheelock maloneys and roisitersand dean lyons. this will surely regain some confidence in the state and gardia. the wheelock s and maloneys have nothing to hide this all there asking for they justwant to know what happened the medical evidence speaks for it self the inconsistencies coming from gardia are truly shocking. and there is no one on this site how can justify this not even pj stone. with all there spin there is no substence to their smear . and when the truth does come out it will be the state that looks foolish not the wheelocks or maloneys. and i know this for a FACT. and i support the garda reserve that the gardia fear so much that they have threatened to break the law. but the only thing that will be broken by the the reserve is the gardia's mafia like code omerta never rat on a cop to quote the eminent justice morris, endemic in the garda force the reserve will be civilians from there communitys who if any wrongdoing is spoted there the reserve will more than likely be a source of strenght to good cops who will have people to support their claims all in all the reserve is good thig it will have problems but they will be weeded out. so agents of the state stop spreading smear stick to the facts.
great to see shrewsbury rd ballsbridge have people are somewhat in touch with ordinary ireland (not) - thought people like tommy didn't care about us joe soaps! First off "agent of the state?" your talking about facts what do you know about be to call me an "agent of the state". Your not very informed, which isn't suprising living in your €35m house! anyway there is no release form from a garda station. The garda reserve is a great idea my guess is the gardai are using it as a bargining tool for proper equipment and the reserve will complement the gardai very well! tommy your out of touch so i'll go and eat cake and you can sit in your ivory tower!
I beg to differ mossie . first piont IT IS compulsory to sign a release form from any garda station or prison or mental institution or any place of detention on these islands.
This is required by the state to verify that a prisoner was indeed in state custody bythe prisoners own signitore.
Secondly i dont think the garda reserve was being used as a bargaining tool by the GRA. and as you said it would compliment gardai. if the gardia want more equipment they just have to ask they are the only organization that can do this due to their huge influence on the media. The gra are terrified of the reserve they are treatening to break the law and the will of the people as abargaining tool? i dont think so! who are they, the IRA? no there are afraid of what a garda reserve might expose years of bad practise best kept secrets in the state of wrong doing and corruption remember donegal was a smoke screen a sacrificial lamb put forwaard by the force and state. the tip of the iceberg my friend time will tell all myfriend mossie.
you are very niaeve if you think the wheelock case and maloney case deserve internal investigation the name itself projects dark innuendo. its asuond byte internal. internal what? we need transparacey. those dark old days are gone. no longer do we need a gaurd to look us in the eye and we beleive all, best part of the time they perjure themselves in the" interest of justice"those days are gone along with the priests currupt politicians the currupt cops will also be exposed. remember the dublin monaghan bombings commisioner of police larry wren new the indentity of those loylist killers but wuould not even interview them even when ther names were put forward. coincidently a bill was being put forward the special criminal court section 30 offences against the state act. widely beleived that it would be defeated.
until the bombing a day befor, the bill was passed.
i'm more in touch with ordianary people than you know.
best of luck to the wheelock family and the maloney famiy in their campaign for TRUTH and JUSTICE.
tommy, tommy, tommy you dont have a clue! what legislation is this release order set out in? you havent got a clue - if gardai can avail of anything they require why then are they always harping on about a radio network that wont and cant work - why are they driving shite boxes of garda cars when when their english collegues are driving bmw's, french - c5's and germans mercs? Any garda i see on o connell st uniform is ill fitting. the training in the garda college in templemore is world renound for its high standards but when those standards stop outside the college your going to have problems! here's the deal tommy, you give me the act this release form is set out in or a link to it and i'll eat an ill fitting garda cap from some poor cold garda on o connell st and shut my mouth!!!!! lets see if you reply now?
Moss ie replying to your thread. i dont think the wheelock and maloney, or the rossiters are to concerned about the gardias as you put it , ill fitting uniform. or they cant drive around in leather interiors luxuary cars with air conditioning at the taxpayers expense. i havent seen them in bangers i see them in new comfortable fast car of the year ford mondeos and thats unfrom gardia detectives are driving angthing from lexus to audias.
alsso garda top brass issued these uniforms and requested them garda gra want robocop style so called war on terror intimidating uniforms totally over the top.
and the radio system your talking about pulse thats there own doing why are they only assigned 3 numbers on there state issued mobile phones? because they were using mobile at the taxpayers expense to ring friends and family and international calls.
and the release form that people sign when there being released from a garda station. is enshrined in legislation passed in 1984.
The criminal justice act 1984 requires the minister for justice, to equality and law reform to make regulations providing for the treatment of persons in custody and garda siochana stations.
The first and only body of regulations to be made under this power came into force on may 16, 1987 under the title, The criminal justice act 1984 (Treatment of persons in garda custody in garda siochana stations) Regulattions 1987. Although the title of the regulations specifically refers to the criminal justice act 1984, it is important to note from the start that they are generally applicableto ALL suspects in garda custody irrespective of the powers of arrest or detention.
you should look this legeislation up for the reference your looking for mossie or the garda pr people will brief you. yes mossie there are safe gaurds for people in garda custody which are rountinely broken by individuals who are charged with their health and care. as in the WHEELOCK, MALONEY, ROSSITERS, MCBREARTY, SHORT, LYONS, KELLY, and many other case's, the cosequence's of individual garda breaking these rules can often as we have seen end up in misscarraiges of justice and even DEATH. This legislation was not just dreamed up it was badly needed. And still does not go far enough in ensuring that gardia do not interfer with custody record s at will to suit them selves when thing to go tragically wrong, as seen in the WHEELOCK MALONEY, AND ROSITERS CASES.
I get the impression mossie you think this is a bit of a joke this is not the offical garda webiste this is a site for the maloney wheelock and rossiters and you dont seem to have anything positive to say about the much needed garda reform that has ended up in high number high profile UNEXPLAINED DEATHS IN GARDA CUSTODY.
NOT TO MENTION GARDA TRIBUNALS to the tune of millions because these bad garda wont speak when investiged and have to be summoned to tribunals.
so if your only concern is for that POOR (well paid) garda on oconnel st because his hat wont fit because his head is so BIG. poor gaurd!
you should go take a long hard look at the Boo WOO problems of the garda press offfice stied in garda tabliods the star the herald and the garda sunday world terrifing the nation in to giving up their civil rights, by the much hype small amount of criminal shooting each other over drugs and out of their head on drugs. and weigh it up against the young teenage and even children dying in garda custody. mind you all from working class estates. wait till it happens to someone from blackrock college! theyll have the best paid barristers in the country to bring down the goverment!!
wont happen though as with all bullies, these gaurds know who their picking on.
i agree, tommy there is much need for garda reform as theses case's have shown, there is something terribly wrong if just as some have suggested wrongly onthis site that they diid commit suicide . find it hard to believe though with these vandal and suicide proof cells. Why did they wait to do it in garda station? What were they trying to frame the Garda! dont think so.
Badly need independent investigaters.
Good look with their campaign
tommy hold on you have danced around what i've asked, with reams of shite talk!! Criminal Justice Act 1984??????? What section of this act legislates for this release order????????? The treatment of person in custody requlations are ONLY regulations!!!!!! not laws. If your going to prove me wrong please give me the act, section and maybe even wording of this release order you speak of!! Truth is there is none and you have been talking shite, shite with more shite!! I've no doubt your reply will be more of the same daancing around issues and questions!!! I'll wait and see
mosspeat, what is your problem? of course this site is about questions.
many unanswered questions, and very valid questions.yes and when properly probed by an independent investigater will lead to many more questions than answers. and the only shite talk is my sad friend coming from you just read your threads.
you asked what bill this fell under go look it up! just asit state a person is obliged to sign for their rights when in garda custody, they are obliged to sign a release form leaving the station. treatment of persons in garda custody 1987. as well if some one is charged the must sign a bail bond . what planet are you living on mossie why are you whinning? go ask your cold friend the garda on occonell st.
you cannont argue your piont validly.
all that you are good for is smearing the deaths of innocent teenagers
with your lies false claims and distortions of facts
yes facts there is such a word it is the truth and yes mossie small people like you who hide behind computers smearing the names of the dead. are sad.
the shite talk that you are talking about is the request of the families
of young men ,teenagers and a child to ask for the sake of transperancey in a civilized democratic society, these priciple still mean something to people, for an INDEPENDENT PUBLIC ENQUIRY TO ESTABLISH INDEPENDENTLY OF ANY INTERNAL GARDA INVESTIGING THEMSELVES
THE FACTS ,FACTS ,FACTS we dont want to hear lies anymore bruise and marks an for christsake deaths somebody in the gardia are responsible.
these people mark my words mossie and comeback and visit this site someday these abusers of power bullies will be outed by their own colleagues because they are dragging their good name down.
the MALONEYS WHEELOCKS AND ROSSITERS WILL GET JUSTICE IF THEY STICK IN THIER they have lost their loved one that people cared about and loved with friends, families and in some cases chilldren who will grow up and not know their young fathers it is a national disgrace so go find another site of dead people and smear their names with your lies you coward.
so a release order is now a bail bond?? I think your mixing up you acts. The bail act of 1997 deals with bail from garda stations not the criminal justice act 1984.
So there is no release order? is that what you are saying?
A bail bond is an undertaking that you make to show up at court on an agreed date not on release from custody! You must be charged to sign a bond otherwise you dont sign anything on your release!
DO YOU HEAR ME? YOU DONT SIGN ANYTHING ON YOUR RELEASE!!!!! UNDERSTAND? I HOPE YOUR NO A SOLICITOR OR ELSE GOD HELP YOUR CLIENTS!
I think you'll find im right and your worng but i've no doubt your reply will be full of your usual ill informed shite!
Soon hope your a victim of crime so you can climb down from your ivory tower to open the door to the people who keep scumbags from overthrowing this state!!!! Maybe i'll see you on a training course for the reserve, maybe then you'll understand how things works outside shrewsbury road!!
The only victims of crime on this site mosssie are the wheelock and maloney families plus rossiters cimes from the state . we kow the gaurds have atough job. but thr rougue elements are in there and must be otued for law and order to thrive and i will jion the reserve just to keep an eye on thing maybe ill be the first whistle blower. corruption is rampant in the force.
97 act does not apply to staion bail it was always there mossie. was ther no bail befor 97. release form is signiture of you rights then you are free to go i know mossie . you are full of shite . i know because i know. you are dis information sad sad sad. keep it real speak about things you know moosie well all know about the thin blue line and chaos you read to much tabliods are you afraid to come out of your house because i'm not. keep it real mossie . gaurds are human like everyone else with faults to some good some bad . and some very bad i know. and so do does family. your the one talking shite mossie.
i have nothing eles to say. upppppsss . sorry. thats a criminal expression. eh mossie?
i wrote a reply but it was taken down from the site by some mup... i mean some one!
So there is no release order your wrong tommy accept it - you were talking through your........ anyway i'm tired of your crap at this stage!
I've no doubt in your reply you wont accept i was right and you were wrong, instead your going to waffle on about justice for people who if you saw them walking down your road in ballsbridge you'd be peering through the curtins wondering if you should call the gardai?
And no doubt you would!
I'm tired of this now - justice for anyone who deserves it, but i guess its not that easy with our court system.
Anyway people like you will get justice cos you can afford it. For the rest of us we'll place our hopes in the arms of the gardai, who in my view held this state together for so long and continue to do so!!!!
GARDAI RULE!!!!!!!
thank you and goodbye!!!!!
So Mossie "justice for anyone that deserves it"
if is seen "these people walking down my road i would ring the gaurds"
What are you talking about?
i will waffle on as you put it!
because each cittizen of the irish state enshrined in the irish constitution are equal and regardless of their creed or percieved class are entitled to justice you doorknob.
your right about the courts but this is nothing to with the courts, this is gardai stonewalling with their red tape , wall of silence, and garda facists unions, ignoring the Maloney wheelock .rossiters families for an independent public enquiry..
What is their to hide?
This would clear up all matters and vindicate their good and just name!
bring it on so we can give the familys peace of mind about what happend to their loved ones in the custody and care of an garda shiochana.
and if your forgetting or maybe your not aware of opinions out there because you sourround yourself with media hype and gardai, that the courts are the buffers between gardai and a police state which is the direction the west is heading.
so thank god the judicury enshrined in the constitution are independent of goverment an police.
will not bow in there learned and considered opinions be dictated and bullied in to eroding citizens civil and human rights
Gardai do not rule, they serve the public mossie.
and if" i seen one of these lads walking down my road" blah blah
it seems mossie you have the stereo type issues. with your ranting about my address
you have not met these lads but you percieve them as some sort of threat to the public? very strange indeed.
and i sleep in one room working for an embassy. door knob!
you are very very class discriminate in your small world , small mind staring nieavely into cyber space!
their is no substence to your arguments,
they are biased discriminate and closed.and tighter than a garda's arse may be a good crack of a new supersize baton across the head would bring you back down to where real people live JUSTICE FOR ALL.
Ah no wonder you talk so much shit, you have immunity from all crime in the state with the position you hold! I’ve no doubt Garda protection also for your employer and his staff!!!
Anyway you worry about your consulates country and leave Ireland to the people who choose to protect it and put their life on the line for it every day.
Anyway I’ve observed no reply about the Release Order so I’ll take it that I am correct!
I’m sick of this now and not replying to some one who worries about another country rather than the one he so badly wants to criticise, because the Gardai are an arm of this state!!
Wonder what your employer would think of your views if he knew??????
………………this is the end!
admitting defeat mossie you loser people 1 gardai 0.
mossie go grow on a some sewage pipe somewhere.
we at the embassy view these case's with increasing concern, as with international human rights watch, in case you do not know we are part of a bigger union since 1973, its the EU and now that the convention on international human rights is incorporated in irish law, (after years of delaying) the irish goverment WILL abide by these laws. The shambolic internal affairs system was the first head of geneva replacing it with a garda ombudsman still teething problems though. but senior heads will roll over these very strange case's in ireland. Wait and see mossie. you got your quest for the legislation.
And my employer has a personel interest in this case and we at the embassy view your threads with amusement and bewilderment.
No doubt you are an isolated figure with your extreme views and narrowmindedness. but thank god for free speach eh? although if you were in charge that would go to eh? think not
just like your views that has been challenged. moss is a fungas that grows insidious and left untreated will eventually spread to what ever it touches. that is why you need powerful disinfectants to restore balance. goodbye mossie. go haunt another dead teenagers site.
yeah mossie easy to smear dead people????????
reading your comments you said john maloney died from leakeage in his back......
from drugs"
that is a lie, he died from haemorageing. you sicko.
first i heard he was a criminal.,.....
is there anything happenin with these case.'s. seem ver serious what is your goverment doing about them cop's do this all over the world.
but ireland c'mon man are they as corrupt there as in the state's irish cop's get in to a lot of trouble over here to! LA, Boston ny must be the jeans!
johner was a decent person who came from a great family.it was very tragic what happend to him.and because of the gardai a decent family have to suffer and mossie you are scum and thats all you are justice for johner
it's easy for people like mossie to smear the dead .
these lads died i think people like him forget that.
their familys love them, and they deservre simple answers.
not garda telling lie's and covering their well beaten tracks
A man whose son died shortly after being released from a garda station in may 2003,
has been awarded compensation of 26000 euros from the gardai and the dep of justice
a high court judge found that mr maloney had been beaten up by gardai .
he went to rathfarnam garda station to collect his dead son's clothes an altercation happened with the desk sargent the same sargent that had been present when young john had been arrested.
this altercation then led to john senior been physically attacked and beaten up breakng his arm in the process.
one can only imagine if they could do this to the young mans father what did they to him.
The maloney family have always maintained there son was beaten up and then dumped from the garda station and then later died from his injuries.
gardai strenuosly deny this .
but there are factors in this case that suggest that an assault did take place.
his injuries speak for themselves.
no one was ever arrested in connection with johns death.
and still remains unexplained.
The maloneys stage another protest to highlight johner's case
John outside leinster house
one day there will be justice for the maloney family and other familys who have lost loved one in custody
it is a disgrace what happened john maloney.
will any of the gards tha assaulted mr maloney face charges?
it beggers belief that a judge can find that gardai did assault mr maloney in sundrive garda station.
yet no prosecutions?
whats going on.
Judge Jacqueline Linnane said she accepted evidence that when the grieving father had gone to a the station to reclaim his dead son's tracksuit, gardai had kicked and cuffed him and had broken his arm.
Judge Linnane told Mr Brian Farren, counsel for Mr Maloney, said she accepted Mr Maloney's account of what had happened and said his injuries were consistent with what he had described to the court.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/grieving-dad-ge....html
Give this man a gun?
26000 is a very meager amonut from the dep of justice for breaking someone up in a garda station, a garda recently received compo of 38000 euros for falling of his bike
well dome mr maloney i support your call for an independent inquiry, dont loose heart.
best of luck
Official reports says Johner Maloney died from complications of cocaine use. The toxins poisoned his body.