Lisbon Treaty: Vote Yes or No?

by curious. Sat May 10, 2008 23:55

Just like Nice and Nice 2. if we 'get it wrong' first time around... they'll ask again.
Would they have the cheek to send it back to us if/when we reject it?

by plodder Sun May 11, 2008 00:37

Curious, "if we reject it" are the operative words in your hypothetical question. First the No campaigners have got to convince the joeandmary voters to vote against the Lisbon Treaty. Then we can worry about the replay.

What's advertised in the item above only convinces me that Dublincentric activity isn't going to sway the voters nationwide. As I've posted elsewhere, people have got to drive around the villages and towns, as FF, FG and Lab are doing, and wear out shoe leather walking from door to door to convince the Don'tKnows that No is the place to put their X on.

by Dr No Mon May 12, 2008 18:42

Personally I'd still put money on the yes side winning. Not because they are right. But they've the media, the main parties and the business establishment. There are a number of complicating factors. I predict the media doing a hatchet job on Libertas for their connections with Big Business interests (in particualar McEvaddy's links to US military in Shannon), and I expect the Trade Union leaders and the Labour Party to throw dust in workers' eyes about workers rights and the race to the bottom. It's not going to be easy to win but it certainly can be a No vote depending on the public mood in the last few days.

PS: Richard Boyd Barrett and Rory Hearne are members of the Socialist Workers' Party.

by Jay - none Tue May 13, 2008 12:38

..but your boring! So what about their membership of the swp- who cares. I don't see you organising any meetings/debates or action over Lisbon. Well done to the alliance and all the work they are putting into the Lisbon campaign..

by For Socialism Wed May 14, 2008 13:41

The lack of Democracy in Europe is obvious !

The Vote "NO" by the Irish would be a first step, for a Democratic and Socialist Europe.

by jamesG Sun Jun 08, 2008 13:34

Ireland please vote No, Most of us europeans didn't get a say (and that's because they knew we would vote no), we don't want it and it will take away your country's own i.d, the E.U wants to destroy your country as we know it.... all across europe people are feeling close to breaking point now and their are difficult times ahead if we are stuck in the EU.
You have a say Ireland and it could alter the whole worlds future.... just say No.
all the things that they are saying about the EU being good for your country is bullsh*t.

by Miriam Sun Jun 08, 2008 16:06

Three quarters of Irish MEP's voted to ignore the outcome of the referendum:

http://www.waterford-today.ie/index.php?option=com_cont...d=227

by mind the step Sun Jun 08, 2008 20:27

Not exactly true.

Only one Irish MEP voted to ignore the outcome of the referendum- Stalinist Proinsias De Rossa. Even the time servers in Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil knew better than to vote against democracy, even though the motion was put forward by their arch-enemies in Sinn Féin.

by Turbini Mon Jun 09, 2008 15:31

Who controls the media, controls the level of democracy in Europe...

Judge yourself, this is the man and his 'view on life' that together with Murdoch controls the European media
These are all statements of Silvio Berlusconi himself in the weeks before the 2008 elections:

Silvio Berlusconi assures a few weeks before the elections that there is no place in his coalition for persons with a criminal past or with mafia connections (an exception is made for political crimes)

A few days before the elections, Berlusconi remembers one of his previous plans: submit judges at regular times to psychiatric examinations .
Under the previous government of Berlusconi, there were plans to change the juridical system radically and the above suggestion was one of the hot topics.

Silvio Berlusconi says that, in case of a possible victory, the as neutral regarded president Napolitano will have to make place for somebody of his coalition.

Silvio’s right hand and co founder of Forza Italia has another plan.
Senator Dell’Utri (involved in numerous scandals and several times convicted in mafia related crimes) thinks that the history books about the role of the resistance in the second world war have to be changed.
He wants a review of who were the real heroes.
Silvio Berlusconi was at 25 April (national feast of the liberation) not present at the festivities like he has never been in the past.

The late Enzo Biagi was a famous and everywhere respected journalist.
Enzo Biagi was one of the journalists that had to leave the RAI after the so-called ‘Bulgarian diktat’ of Silvio Berlusconi.
He was accused to make a criminal use of television.
Silvio Berlusconi claims until now that Enzo left the RAI out of free will
and that he did it for the money.

Senator Dell’Utri comes with another statement.
He defines a ‘real’ hero: Vittorio Mangano , part of the mafia, an impressing curriculum.
Vittorio worked several years for Berlusconi as ‘horsekeeper’ at his villa(although it seems that there were no horses…)
This man has been defined by the judge Paulo Borsellino as the mafia link to North Italy .
Borsellino died two months after this statement in one of Italies most brutal bomb attacks.
Dell’Utri says literally that ‘Mangano was a hero because he never confessed under pressure compromising things about Berlusconi or Dell’Utri ’.
Silvio Berlusconi confirms this the following day( video on YouTube )

Silvio Berlusconi gets a lot of critics because the business man and newspaper owner Ciarrapico , who is part of Berlusconi’s party, is a convinced fascist and brings until now very proudly the fascist greetings.
Guiseppe Ciarrapico(see picture) is not only an editor of very dubious press releases but has been convicted for numerous crimes.
Silvio Berlusconi says that the fascist sympathies of Ciarrapico are details and that this man is useful to his party because he owns journals and magazines.

Guiseppe Ciarrapico(see picture), as well as Marcello Dell’Utri, and many others with a criminal past and accused of mafia connections are now senators in the Italian parliament…

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More info and references

Silvio Berlusconi: A threath for European democracy?
www.wikio.com/article/54654672

Help Europe: Silvio Berlusconi is taking over the European media
www.wikio.com/article/56367203

Italian crystal nights:first the gypsies,what's next... is this Europe 1938?
www.wikio.com/article/57683499

Silvio Berlusconi and the 'democratic' 2008 election campaign
www.wikio.com/article/57159079

Senator and member of Berlusconi's party 'people of freedom'

by Sean Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:43

It amuses me that people spend their time criticising the country's politicians and then actively campaign to ensure that they have as much power as possible in order to run the country into the ground, as it is often said they are doing.